NBA Free Agency Thread

[SoonerBounce13]

Set them back 5 years minimum.

:ez-roll:

 

[Eielson]

Which is why the thunder wouldn't pay harden the max.

But they'll pay Kanter the max? You don't make sense.

 

[bocabull]

Thunder went to the NBA finals in 2012, then refused to pay Harden a paltry 4 years $52 million, 3 years later they missed the playoffs and Harden led his team to the conference finals. Yeah they weren't set back at all. lol Go play with matches.

 

[SoonerBounce13]

But they'll pay Kanter the max? You don't make sense.

1. Management is allowed to change strategies.
2. Harden wasn't staying. period. not even for max. He wanted to be the man. he wasn't going to in OKC.
3. Harden demands the ball in his hands to be the most effective. This again wasn't going to happen. OKC already had two players that would have the ball in their hands ahead of Harden.
4. That means his value to the thunder was not worth the max b/c they wouldn't utilize him like a max player.
5. Kanter may not be worth the max in a vacuum. but with the thunder he is. He fills in a piece that has been missing for the thunders' tenure in OKC...a scoring thread at the five. His relative value to the team is higher than Harden's was.
6. This was pretty much proven when the thunder had a better year after they traded harden.

 

[Eielson]

1. Management is allowed to change strategies.

Yes, but that's usually an admission of a mistake.

2. Harden wasn't staying. period. not even for max. He wanted to be the man. he wasn't going to in OKC.

Says who? At the time, I was hearing he was willing to stay, but was not going to take a pay cut.

3. Harden demands the ball in his hands to be the most effective. This again wasn't going to happen. OKC already had two players that would have the ball in their hands ahead of Harden.

4. That means his value to the thunder was not worth the max b/c they wouldn't utilize him like a max player.

If they weren't going to be able to utilize Harden as a max player, how in the world are they going to utilize Kanter as a max player?

5. Kanter may not be worth the max in a vacuum. but with the thunder he is. He fills in a piece that has been missing for the thunders' tenure in OKC...a scoring thread at the five. His relative value to the team is higher than Harden's was.

6. This was pretty much proven when the thunder had a better year after they traded harden.

You're just being obnoxious now.

 

[SoonerBounce13]

Yes, but that's usually an admission of a mistake.

um no

Says who? At the time, I was hearing he was willing to stay, but was not going to take a pay cut.

it's pretty obvious.

If they weren't going to be able to utilize Harden as a max player, how in the world are they going to utilize Kanter as a max player?

B/c in two years his contract will be the equivelent of what 12MM is now. This is a max contract for next year. that is it.


You're just being obnoxious now.[/QUOTE]

whether you like it or not or will admit it or not, the thunder don't need another wing that needs the ball in his hands. They need a scoring big. It really isn't a hard thing to grasp.

 

[Eielson]

I almost feel like you'd defend the Thunder if they traded KD or RW for a second rounder---call it a clever cap space dump or something. Half of the things you say when it comes to the Thunder are just absurd.

 

[SoonerBounce13]

I almost feel like you'd defend the Thunder if they traded KD or RW for a second rounder---call it a clever cap space dump or something. Half of the things you say when it comes to the Thunder are just absurd.

Whatever man

stats back up what i'm saying. yours is all opinion.

I'm done debating it with you though b/c neither of us is going to budge

I'll take Sam Presti and his track record over Bill Simmons and message board posters

 

[One More Rebound]

I almost feel like you'd defend the Thunder if they traded KD or RW for a second rounder---call it a clever cap space dump or something. Half of the things you say when it comes to the Thunder are just absurd.

Only half?

 

[SoonerBounce13]

great article on kanter. sorry forgot the link

http://espn.go.com/blog/okc-thunder/post/_/id/611/three-things-to-know-about-okc-signing-kanter

And wow what a miracle..they didn't have to mention harden!

 

[One More Rebound]

Thunder are about 28 million over the salary cap right now. That means they will have to pay a luxury tax of about 24 million. Are their pockets really that deep for a small market team?

 

[SoonerBounce13]

Thunder are about 28 million over the salary cap right now. That means they will have to pay a luxury tax of about 24 million. Are their pockets really that deep for a small market team?

They will makes some moves. they have until sometime near the end of the season to drop salary. They will pay luxury tax but not the top tier

 

[sperry]

They'll also be pocketing a couple mill per home playoff game to soften the blow.

 

[Eielson]

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/insi...in-pelton-breaks-all-free-agent-deals-weekend

Let's start with the obvious: Kanter is not worth $70 million, even as the cap rises. As I wrote Friday, based in part on his poor rating in ESPN's real plus-minus last season (-2.7, 58th among centers), I project Kanter's value at $21 million over the next three seasons.

 

[NickZepp]

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/insi...in-pelton-breaks-all-free-agent-deals-weekend

I’m fully aware of Kanter’s struggles (that’s putting it lightly) on the defensive end of the floor. I’ve seen the Real Plus/Minus numbers making the rounds that show Kanter is the worst defender this side of a Mexican maximum-security prison. Hell, in the past I’ve used RPM as *part* of my player evaluation, largely to help defend Kendrick Perkins’ value to the Thunder.
(For those not hip to these geeky things, RPM attempts to isolate a player’s offense and defense, measured in positive or negative offensive and defensive production, that from his teammates. Being the team sport that basketball is, that’s nearly impossible to do.)
However, no single stat is the end-all, be-all of a player. We’ve been down this road before with PER. It isn’t necessarily a scarlet number branded to a player for life.


First thing I thought of when all of the RPM screenshots started making the rounds on Twitter: does anyone recall who ranked seventh overall in the NBA in overall RPM in 2013-14? Tim Duncan? Kevin Love? Russell Westbrook? Blake Griffin? Nope.

Nick Collison.


Not saying the RPM stat is fatally flawed. It’s just not wise to put an incredible amount of weight on one stat. It’s also important to understand that there’s context to every stat.


Having said all of that, yeah Kanter is light years behind on the defensive end. Either his brain or his feet or both have not allowed him to be an effective NBA defender. But if you insist on playing the RPM card to the max, consider this: Marco Belinelli played 25 minutes per game for the 2013-14 Spurs and had the worst RPM among shooting guards (-3.53). Didn’t seem to affect the Spurs all that much. Having strong defenders around him certainly helped.


Milwaukee’s Khris Middleton posted a DRPM of -3.50 in 2013-14. Last season that number completely flipped and then some. He posted a +4.09 and was the best among shooting guards in that area (and eighth-best in the league). He also just inked a 5-year deal worth $70 million. Funny what better teammates and a better coach can do for a guy.


Let’s give Kanter some actual coaching and a fully healthy group of teammates and then pass judgement.

http://dailythunder.com/2015/07/deep-thoughts-from-a-shallow-mind-kanter-komeback-edition/

Unless the Thunder have a year where Adams and Ibaka are both hurt a lot again Kanter will probably always be in a lineup with or the other making his role as a defender different. He won't be defending the rim at all. Doubt he'll be as exposed. After the trade for him last year Adams injured his arm, Ibaka was never healthy. Then Collison got hurt. It was basically him and McBro at the post positions. Kanter gives the Thunder options inside as a scorer they don't have on the roster. Really the only issues with the Thunder now are guard depth(particularly wings), health, and I'm not sure how Donovan translates well to the NBA.

The Thunder will have a lineup ready for a run from day one next year.

 

[NickZepp]

BTW Next year the Thunder will still be under the tax even after resigning KD to a max contract. Now it could risk the Thunder potentially reupping on Westbrook in a couple years.

 

[SoonerBounce13]

After the trade for him last year Adams injured his arm, Ibaka was never healthy. Then Collison got hurt.

c'mon man, don't forget perry jones lol

People forget that KD wasn't the only one injured last year. far from it.

 

[Eielson]

http://dailythunder.com/2015/07/deep-thoughts-from-a-shallow-mind-kanter-komeback-edition/

Nick Collison was an outlier because he only got about 15 minutes a game. If he was getting 30, he would have been nowhere near as high.

The top 7 this year?

1. Steph Curry
2. Lebron James
3. James Harden
4. Anthony Davis
5. Kawhi Leonard
6. Russell Westbrook
7. Chris Paul

Looks a little like the MVP race, huh?

I'm not saying this is the perfect statistic, but it should be concerning when you're max-deal center is rated 70 out of 70 defensively, just behind Matt Bonner and Andrea Bargnani.

Also, this rating was only in part due to his RPM. This is more than one random statistic.

 

[SoonerBounce13]

Everybody knows he has his defensive issues. but they were vastly overrated by having no help beside him. He is terrible at defending the pick in roll. but should see much improvement this year with a healthy adams and serge.

He is definitely worth a 15-20% of your salary type of player

 

[Smash Williams]

Everybody knows he has his defensive issues. but they were vastly overrated by having no help beside him. He is terrible at defending the pick in roll. but should see much improvement this year with a healthy adams and serge.

He is definitely worth a 15-20% of your salary type of player

Kanter started alongside a terrific frontcourt defender in Derrick Favors.

The Jazz were 19-34 before trading Kanter and finished 19-10 after the Kanter trade. They had the #27 defense before trading Kanter (pre-All Star break) and the #1 defense after trading Kanter (post-All Star break). The Jazz had the best defensive rating in the league by far post-All Star break. They posted a 94.8 defensive efficiency rating; Memphis was second at 99.4. The gap between those two teams was bigger than the gap between Memphis and the #18 team in defensive efficiency during that stretch.

Gobert gets much of the credit for the post-Kanter defensive improvement, but the Jazz were lights out with (94.7) or without (95.1) Gobert on the floor during that stretch.

Thus, it makes no sense to blame Kanter's struggles on Utah, as the Jazz were ridiculously good on defense without him.