Is Willie really the root of our problems currently?

[Cheno]

I just find it odd he can look past Lance Stephenson's issues, a guy he believed was going to be a Jayhawk and wanted over Henry as a Jayhawk but still points outs Willie's.

Look past his issues? When did I do that? In fact I said over and over Stephenson was perfect for KU this year because KU was loaded and it was worth the risk. If he gave Self any trouble he could just boot him. I said that exact thing a number of times. Your inability to be objective and honest is showing.
If your kid has issues you address them honestly, you love him and you continue to support him.
I've never once said I don't want Willie to be a Sooner. In fact, I've been one of his biggest supporters and proponents.
He still needs to get his stuff together.
You seriously think Coach Capel sits him a game if he doesn't feel the same way.
Skirt the issue all you want or deflect it on to me being a Jayhawk or whatever but that's not going to help the situation. In fact it's going to hurt it. I'm glad Capel doesn't take your stance.

 

[Sam]

Look past his issues? When did I do that? In fact I said over and over Stephenson was perfect for KU this year because KU was loaded and it was worth the risk. If he gave Self any trouble he could just boot him. I said that exact thing a number of times. Your inability to be objective and honest is showing.
If your kid has issues you address them honestly, you love him and you continue to support him.
I've never once said I don't want Willie to be a Sooner. In fact, I've been one of his biggest supporters and proponents.
He still needs to get his stuff together.
You seriously think Coach Capel sits him a game if he doesn't feel the same way.
Skirt the issue all you want or deflect it on to me being a Jayhawk or whatever but that's not going to help the situation. In fact it's going to hurt it. I'm glad Capel doesn't take your stance.

You adamantly defended the kid on this board mainly due to his Jayhawk ties (or at least his potential of it). It seemed to me you made excuses for some of his heated out bursts and other potential red flags people brought up. While for Willie you have no qualms about pointing them out and saying the pattern he is showing is a big issue, not sure why Lance's pattern wasn't a big issue but hey everybody thinks different. Maybe Willie's immaturity issues will lead to adversity which will just bring the team closer together like a spat with a football team would.

 

[JBaker]

Haven't been on this board today... Has the info James posted about WW being suspended Saturday been posted here?

 

[SuperFresh2]

IMHO, WW is not the root of all the problems, but if you want to start to try to find the root, you'd want to look in his general direction.

Its clear to me that he's so far been a very selfish basketball player, and when things don't go his way, he sulks and shows horrible body language. This is what bothers me the most because it can permeate the rest of the team and if he isn't careful, I can see TMG falling into the same habits.

My suspicion is that WW started to read enough of his press clippings and started to believe all the unbelievable preseason hype surrounding him to the point that HE believes that HE's far and away the best player on this team, and maybe the only player on this team. I also believe that he's overly concerned about his draft status for the 2010 NBA draft and more preoccupied with his pro prospects than anything else. The problem with that is, after watching him this season I don't believe that he'll make a good pro.

In any event, kudos to Coach Capel for doing what was necessary by sending both him and the rest of the team a message by benching him. This was an outstanding coaching move and one that was sorely needed. Right now, WW isn't a leader, and to date, he's also not someone that is willing to consistently make those around him better. Blake had that; WW does not (at least not to this point) and Coach needs folks on the floor who have their heads here, not el$ewhere, and who are willing to do what's necessary to continue to make Sooner Basketball something we can all be proud of.

Now that all said, I also don't believe its all gloom and doom. I do believe that this team will only go as far as WW will take them, simply due to the youth of the team in key positions. WW is also only a Soph, so age and maturity are still things that he has to learn. I do think Coach Capel and The Staff will get that straightened out and we will have a nice season in the end. We have some nice parts to work with and I think our squad will play its best when WW stops forcing everything and instead looks to distribute first and make those around him better- if he does that, team success will follow and so will his offensive numbers. However, if for some reason he doesn't, I fear that this team and his draft status will go down the tubes in '09- '10 and will only get better after WW's departure.

I'm sure there are many who will likely disagree with me, and that's cool- I don't claim to have any real info, instead this is just my opinion. Sorry for the long post and thanks for your time.

 

[SuperFresh2]

......of course, none of that will do anything to cure the rebounding problems. That's a whole additional issue entirely.

 

[campbest]

You adamantly defended the kid on this board mainly due to his Jayhawk ties (or at least his potential of it). It seemed to me you made excuses for some of his heated out bursts and other potential red flags people brought up. While for Willie you have no qualms about pointing them out and saying the pattern he is showing is a big issue, not sure why Lance's pattern wasn't a big issue but hey everybody thinks different. Maybe Willie's immaturity issues will lead to adversity which will just bring the team closer together like a spat with a football team would.

I couldn't give a rats ass about "Born Ready" and how is previous transgressions define him, all I know is that WW has had his problems in the past and it appears (from my view) that they are resurfacing. If that makes me a jayhawk, whatever.

 

[PeteHoops]

SuperFresh, the only have I have missed is San Diego and so I cannot speak for that game, but the other games I have watched I thought Willie deferred too much at times. He is the best player on our team, his attitude stinks, but we need him with the ball in his hands most of the time. I don't think he has been selfish, how many shots a game is he taking? Around 15, that is not enough...if you look at the great players that get all the hype like say Beasley and Durant for recent examples...they were taking 20 plus shots a night, that's what you want from your best player.

In reference to his attitude, I think it has a lot to do with the expectations he has for himself. Lets face it we need him if we are going to go anywhere. I have posted before he needs to quit worrying so much about how his shorts look and play, but the frustration he shows has a lot to do with what he expects of himself.

The root of our problems is that we have a young team with a SOPH trying to be the leader, some can do it (Blake) and some cannot. We need Crocker and Davis to step up along with Willie and show the young guys how to work. Its easy to get along when everything is going your way. It'll be interesting to see how things turn out now that they aren't.

Also in defense of WW, the girl everyone talks about between him and AJ is a jersey chaser and I am not trying to start anything if she has friends here, but she just went after the better prospect. Hard to blame an 18 yr old for taking what's given to him...

 

[cfin5256]

Actually PeteHoops, I wondered myself if some of the problem was that WW was deferring too much in the games. He wasn't being aggresive on the court until we were pretty much out of the game.

 

[bocabull]

WTF is a thread like this doing on OU hoops? Especially the title. Threads like this really make you understand why high level athletes and business executives avoid the average joe like the plague.

 

[Sam]

I couldn't give a rats ass about "Born Ready" and how is previous transgressions define him, all I know is that WW has had his problems in the past and it appears (from my view) that they are resurfacing. If that makes me a jayhawk, whatever.

Would you try to spin a fight between the OU football team and OU basketball team in a positive light for OU basketball?
I am not defending Willie as much as I'm saying is Chendog's Jayhawk is showing because he is handling Willie's issues different because he is a Sooner than he would if he was a Jayhawk.

 

[campbest]

Would you try to spin a fight between the OU football team and OU basketball team in a positive light for OU basketball?
I am not defending Willie as much as I'm saying is Chendog's Jayhawk is showing because he is handling Willie's issues different because he is a Sooner than he would if he was a Jayhawk.

If they're going to fight, guess I would rather have them fight as a group against someone else rather than amongst themselves.

However, I don't think the "fight" is a big deal at all, that was two months ago and no one cares anymore. Willie's actions are a big deal.

 

[Cheno]

If they're going to fight, guess I would rather have them fight as a group against someone else rather than amongst themselves.

Which is the ONLY thing I said when "team chemistry" or lack there of was brought up about KU. I said if anything it showed the team had a bond.
In no way was I saying the KU situation between the football team and the basketball team was a positive. I said it wouldn't hurt team chemistry. And by the looks of things it hasn't.

If anyone is doing any spinning here it's you Sam.
And I don't know why the heck we're talking about KU anyways.
If you'd like to address KU basketball or me personally feel free to start your own thread on the smack board or send me a PM and spare the rest of us.

 

[SoonerBounce13]

I hope so...but it's the pattern that bothers me.
Seems like going back to high school to today there have been a lot of WW attitude instances. And they seemingly always have been described as "not that big a deal". Willie how about we just don't have any more instances at all? Just be quiet and play.

can you list these instances? I really have not heard of any of them.

 

[Sam]

Which is the ONLY thing I said when "team chemistry" or lack there of was brought up about KU. I said if anything it showed the team had a bond.
In no way was I saying the KU situation between the football team and the basketball team was a positive. I said it wouldn't hurt team chemistry. And by the looks of things it hasn't.

If anyone is doing any spinning here it's you Sam.
And I don't know why the heck we're talking about KU anyways.
If you'd like to address KU basketball or me personally feel free to start your own thread on the smack board or send me a PM and spare the rest of us.

LOL, you're never going to change are you?

 

[playmakr]

I guess I'm in the very small minority who thinks Willie's "problem" was minor.

 

[BigTime]

I guess I'm in the very small minority who thinks Willie's "problem" was minor.

It was minor. And he didn't fight with any teammates. He was frustrated just like the rest of us. I bet he will be ready to go on Wednesday. :OU-logo:

 

[Cheno]

I guess I'm in the very small minority who thinks Willie's "problem" was minor.

I don't think you are in the minority. Let's hope it's behind him and he comes out with a great attitude and ready to lead this team. It needs him to. I think he will.

 

[gracefor24]

I guess I'm in the very small minority who thinks Willie's "problem" was minor.

Which isn't surprising, you have played college sports and understand what really goes on. Everyone has issues at times. Also, the average fan has a pretty big knee jerk reaction to 3 losses in a row. The funny thing is that fans have no idea that the players are taking this way harder than they are and are working their butts off right now to change it.

 

[playmakr]

Which isn't surprising, you have played college sports and understand what really goes on. Everyone has issues at times. Also, the average fan has a pretty big knee jerk reaction to 3 losses in a row. The funny thing is that fans have no idea that the players are taking this way harder than they are and are working their butts off right now to change it.

Exactly. I haven't given any emotional and physical investment into the team like they have. I'll let them work through their trials without assuming anything about a situation.

I especially don't understand why some think that all the little basketball angels are going to fly right 365 days of the year and there is never going to be issues. I don't think I ever played on a team at any level that didn't get at least 1 guy kicked off at some point during the year. (not that Willie is anywhere near that sort of punishment) In fact, I don't recall ever playing for a team whether it be high school, college, AAU or anything else where there wasn't a fist fight until someone was half-unconscious or some sort of brawl. I witnessed a prominent high school player not to be named almost beat an assistant AAU coach to death. Said player played 4 years at a major D1 power, with nary an issue. 90% of team at UIC were chronic marijuana smokers, a few did X, one got kicked out of school on a felonly cocaine trafficking charge. Being frustrated with how you are personally performing (hell I think the demise of willie's play thus far is grossly exaggerated to begin with) and acting up by misleading the team how he did is so minor, you almost have to laugh at the absurdity of all the knee jerk reactions going on. Way worse goes on every day.

 

[gracefor24]

Exactly. I haven't given any emotional and physical investment into the team like they have. I'll let them work through their trials without assuming anything about a situation.

I especially don't understand why some think that all the little basketball angels are going to fly right 365 days of the year and there is never going to be issues. I don't think I ever played on a team at any level that didn't get at least 1 guy kicked off at some point during the year. (not that Willie is anywhere near that sort of punishment) In fact, I don't recall ever playing for a team whether it be high school, college, AAU or anything else where there wasn't a fist fight until someone was half-unconscious or some sort of brawl. I witnessed a prominent high school player not to be named almost beat an assistant AAU coach to death. Said player played 4 years at a major D1 power. Being frustrated with how you are personally performing (hell I think the demise of willie's play thus far is grossly exaggerated to begin with) and acting up by misleading the team how he did is so minor, you almost have to laugh at the absurdity of all the knee jerk reactions going on.

Everybody on this board should read this post. So true.