March Madness and Covid-19

[hoopsaustin]

that is a matter of opinion and lies in the realm of politics.

Markets are opinion? Hmm.. unemployment rates are opinion? Hmm..

We need to be opening up the businesses. Not doing what California is talking about doing..

I dont mean to talk politics but this keeping people from fishing on beaches alone and keeping businesses forcibly closed has to stop asap

 

[hoopsaustin]

Answering that question would require violating the rules of this forum. Happy to discuss it via PM if you like.

Fair enough. Send me a pm (no juco)

 

[stormspencer]

Local radio station says that you can get free tests at the county seat.....but you have to have symptoms of covid 19.

It's hard for me to think that a re-opening of the economy will work if half the people are afraid to leave their home. I fear it will only lengthen the time of the pandemic.

It would be nice if we had plenty of tests.....even the tests that could tell if you had already been exposed to covid would be helpful.

But it looks to me that we're headed to the "herd mentality" approach with little regard for the number of deaths.

And there in lies the biggest fallacy. I have no polls or scientific data to support a hypothesis as of now, but I really believe a majority of people are fine leaving their homes and working....especially if they are wearing masks and practicing social distancing as well as other safety protocols specific to their vocation. Work brings value and dignity to peoples lives. This can not be underestimated....despite the cries of the alarmists. Yet, there seems to be an unrelenting narrative saying "if you go out in public, you will contract the virus....and you might die". This is utterly f...ing ridiculous. People need to focus in on the stats and who is at risk. Mitigate/isolate those who are vulnerable and then we can begin the slow process of incremental normalcy.

We will eventually have more tests....and hopefully sooner rather than later. However, tests are just a snapshot of the moment. I could be negative today and positive tomorrow....this is a false flag for the long term. And I'm all for antibody tests, but unfortunately they've shown to have an accuracy rate of less than 90%....it has to be better than that for us to make the best policy decisions.

At first, we were told the "stay at home" or "lockdown" orders were to help flatten the curve so that our local healthcare systems don't get overwhelmed. Well...we've done that. Now, it seem the goalposts have been moved. Thus, we have to stay home.....because of.....of what? There needs to be clear definitions and timelines of when we are going to incrementally get back to work. It's actually happening in some places (thank God!). Still, very few of our elected officials have the balls to stand up and provide a definitive plan as to how we are going to do this. It seems a good portion of our leaders would rather not take too hard of a stance because it might hurt them politically.

 

[tooney]

And there in lies the biggest fallacy. I have no polls or scientific data to support a hypothesis as of now, but I really believe a majority of people are fine leaving their homes and working....especially if they are wearing masks and practicing social distancing as well as other safety protocols specific to their vocation. Work brings value and dignity to peoples lives. This can not be underestimated....despite the cries of the alarmists. Yet, there seems to be an unrelenting narrative saying "if you go out in public, you will contract the virus....and you might die". This is utterly f...ing ridiculous. People need to focus in on the stats and who is at risk. Mitigate/isolate those who are vulnerable and then we can begin the slow process of incremental normalcy.

We will eventually have more tests....and hopefully sooner rather than later. However, tests are just a snapshot of the moment. I could be negative today and positive tomorrow....this is a false flag for the long term. And I'm all for antibody tests, but unfortunately they've shown to have an accuracy rate of less than 90%....it has to be better than that for us to make the best policy decisions.

At first, we were told the "stay at home" or "lockdown" orders were to help flatten the curve so that our local healthcare systems don't get overwhelmed. Well...we've done that. Now, it seem the goalposts have been moved. Thus, we have to stay home.....because of.....of what? There needs to be clear definitions and timelines of when we are going to incrementally get back to work. It's actually happening in some places (thank God!). Still, very few of our elected officials have the balls to stand up and provide a definitive plan as to how we are going to do this. It seems a good portion of our leaders would rather not take too hard of a stance because it might hurt them politically.

I don't believe it's a fallacy.....and there are plenty of polls that support my statement....

https://www.politico.com/news/2020/05/13/poll-coronavirus-reopen-trump-republicans-252726

From the article.....

But it also risks putting Trump and the GOP out of step with the majority of voters on the most urgent issue facing the country just months before the presidential election. Fifty-six percent of voters overall say they’re more concerned about public health than the economy, though that is a drop of 8 percentage points from April 10 to 12, when they were first asked.

“As Congress reconvenes, a sharp political divide continues, as Republicans are increasingly more concerned with the pandemic's economic impact, though a plurality of voters feel the country is reopening too quickly,” said Tyler Sinclair, vice president at Morning Consult.

There are other polls....I was unable to find one that stated that most people thought it was time to reopen.

Dr. Fauci testified during the senate hearing a couple of days ago.....warning that reopening too soon could have dire consequences. Yesterday, the President rejected the warning.

Yesterday, there was a motion in the Senate to release the CDC report on reopening guidelines.
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/schume...rt-reopening-guidelines-coronavirus-pandemic/

It was rejected.....you can probably guess as to who objected.

It seems painfully obvious that some want to listed to the experts on the pandemic.....and others are more concerned with opening the economy today.

And I'm not saying that we can't do both.....but you need a plan. And there hasn't been a plan in the last four months. And I don't expect one now either.

Letting the state's governors decide is risky bc they are easily swayed by politics. They see their economies failing, so they bet on the chance that they can ignore the scientists. The problem is that a lot of the public is listening to the scientists......and the scientists are revising the death estimates upward.
https://www.usnews.com/news/nationa...d-us-coronavirus-deaths-jump-as-states-reopen

From the US News and World Report article above...
Projected U.S. Coronavirus Deaths Jump as States Reopen
A new model projects that 147,000 Americans could die from the coronavirus by August – a sharp increase over a total predicted as recently as Sunday.

I live in SW Oklahoma.....and there are plenty of people walking around in walmart that never wear a mask, totally disregard all the safety precautions that the governors suggest. But there are also plenty of people that refuse to leave their homes because of the other people. If any plan is to work, it has to be enforced.

 

[WTSooner]

And I'm not saying that we can't do both.....but you need a plan. And there hasn't been a plan in the last four months. And I don't expect one now either.

Letting the state's governors decide is risky bc they are easily swayed by politics.

I don't care how "risky" anybody thinks it is, it's absolutely a decision that should be made and directed by the states. Each state has a unique set of circumstances and is on a unique time line in terms of COVID-19. To try and have the President or Fed government lay out a one-size fits all approach would be a massive overstep.

 

[SoonerBounce13]

https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/unemployment-rate

good site to look at the economy numbers.

 

[SoonerBounce13]

https://www.forbes.com/sites/chuckj...navirus-has-wrecked-the-economy/#475d2e8136da

 

[tooney]

I don't care how "risky" anybody thinks it is, it's absolutely a decision that should be made and directed by the states. Each state has a unique set of circumstances and is on a unique time line in terms of COVID-19. To try and have the President or Fed government lay out a one-size fits all approach would be a massive overstep.

Hopefully, you will be proven correct. But I see governors totally disregarding the epidemiologists and the earlier guidelines laid out by the govt. Blame or fame will be laid at their feet when they had nothing to do with the mess we are all experiencing now.

 

[thebigabd]

Competent leadership at the state and federal level should allow them to work together and work on a cohesive re-opening plan for each state.

I would have liked to see all 50 govs working in tandem with the federal government and release a big opening up document that everyone was on board with. That would have given people confidence in leadership.

Instead, they are fighting.

 

[coolm]

I dont mean to talk politics but this keeping people from fishing on beaches alone and keeping businesses forcibly closed has to stop asap

If you dont MEAN to keep talking politics then stop talking politics. your view isn't the only one and certainly doesn't represent the entire country. you spew a bunch of opinionated tripe and then when we refuse to answer it you come back and say "what about what I just said? no answer for that huh?" which is delusional. there are plenty of answers and rebuttals that you plainly refuse to acknowledge or consider sua sponte.

 

[steverocks35]

Here's the problem with not having a coherent national response, and leaving it up to the individual states: There are not walls around every state that are impenetrable to viruses, and people freely travel from state to state to state. The virus doesn't care what state someone is in. The idea of "Well Oklahoma is doing fine, we should open up" is not realistic and doesn't take into account the country as a whole. We have flattened the curve, SO FAR, but if we stop what we are doing in the middle, the curve will go straight back up. We need robust testing and contact tracing, and not just of symptomatic people, of as many people as we can test, before we "open up" but that isn't going to happen and I fear many more people are going to die than necessary. Even South Korea, which most people agree has been the model for how to handle this pandemic, is having to close back down as cases are re-emerging.

This is a very interesting approach I found in my inbox this morning. I'm still mulling it over, but it proposes combined samples by household that can be tested with only one test per event.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/kotlikoff/2020/05/03/dr-fauci-heres-a-way-to-contain-covid-19-and-reopen-the-economy-in-as-little-as-one-month/#3367f72a1c7a

 

[steverocks35]

By the way, Texas had a new high for new Covid-19 cases yesterday, 1,355.

 

[SoonerBounce13]

Here's the problem with not having a coherent national response, and leaving it up to the individual states: There are not walls around every state that are impenetrable to viruses, and people freely travel from state to state to state. The virus doesn't care what state someone is in. The idea of "Well Oklahoma is doing fine, we should open up" is not realistic and doesn't take into account the country as a whole. We have flattened the curve, SO FAR, but if we stop what we are doing in the middle, the curve will go straight back up. We need robust testing and contact tracing, and not just of symptomatic people, of as many people as we can test, before we "open up" but that isn't going to happen and I fear many more people are going to die than necessary. Even South Korea, which most people agree has been the model for how to handle this pandemic, is having to close back down as cases are re-emerging.

This is a very interesting approach I found in my inbox this morning. I'm still mulling it over, but it proposes combined samples by household that can be tested with only one test per event.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/kotlikoff/2020/05/03/dr-fauci-heres-a-way-to-contain-covid-19-and-reopen-the-economy-in-as-little-as-one-month/#3367f72a1c7a

so basically, b/c New York is really bad, Oklahoma should suffer?

The group family testing seems like a logical deal if there are enough tests available

 

[SoonerBounce13]

By the way, Texas had a new high for new Covid-19 cases yesterday, 1,355.

No surprising

 

[steverocks35]

so basically, b/c New York is really bad, Oklahoma should suffer?

The group family testing seems like a logical deal if there are enough tests available

No, because the virus doesn't respect borders and this pandemic is not over yet, we should not stop what we are doing that is working. To me it's kind of like someone 1,000 feet from the ground saying, "You know what? I'm floating along nicely, this is going great, but these straps are starting to chafe my skin, I don't need this parachute anymore." And then cutting loose their chute.

 

[steverocks35]

[TWEET]https://twitter.com/TODAYshow/status/1260896846538514433?s=20[/TWEET]

This is wild... NBC's go-to guy for providing information about Covid-19, Dr. Joseph Fair, is now in the hospital battling the disease.

 

[coolm]

I can see using that group approach once you have an initial wave covered. I actually think that's a winner there. That way you're essentially creating a pseudo-clean area and the group testing is the control point measure. That method is exactly what we use to clear major areas and declare them open and clean. You get that little virus narrowed down and then tackle the minor outbreaks with tracing and quarantine.

Not sure how you whittle down the groups though. It would make most sense to do it by neighborhoods and see if you needed to make the groups bigger or smaller based on that initial test. Once you can declare an area clean then you just keep retesting with a good periodicity and issue the green wristlets. Thats an excellent plan.

 

[steverocks35]

I can see using that group approach once you have an initial wave covered. I actually think that's a winner there. That way you're essentially creating a pseudo-clean area and the group testing is the control point measure. That method is exactly what we use to clear major areas and declare them open and clean. You get that little virus narrowed down and then tackle the minor outbreaks with tracing and quarantine.

Not sure how you whittle down the groups though. It would make most sense to do it by neighborhoods and see if you needed to make the groups bigger or smaller based on that initial test. Once you can declare an area clean then you just keep retesting with a good periodicity and issue the green wristlets. Thats an excellent plan.

I agree, I think it's an excellent idea, the implementation might be difficult though because of many factors, not the least of which is ignorance.

 

[hoopsaustin]

If you dont MEAN to keep talking politics then stop talking politics. your view isn't the only one and certainly doesn't represent the entire country. you spew a bunch of opinionated tripe and then when we refuse to answer it you come back and say "what about what I just said? no answer for that huh?" which is delusional. there are plenty of answers and rebuttals that you plainly refuse to acknowledge or consider sua sponte.

Eh i couldn't care less what you say or think. So I'll just keep my current course and considering your scenario is not what happened at all.. maybe reconsider which party is the delusional party

 

[Sooner04]

Where are you located?

The seat of Cleveland County, America.