Are we seeing a power shift in the Big 12?

[thebigabd]

OU has been a fixture in the top 4 of the Big 12 standings since the conferences inception, but finished up this year as the worst team in the Big 12 and also finished poorly before Blake Griffin arrived. But thats not really what this thread is about.....

Baylor, Kansas State, Texas A&M, and Missouri were teams that you could count on beating pretty much every year (except in Columbia)... Hell, A&M and Baylor were an easy 4 wins for OU, and that makes up about 40% of the win total in conference if you win 10 games.

Nebraska, Colorado, Tech, and ISU have never been easy wins for Oklahoma like Baylor and A&M used to be.

Now you are going to see those four teams in the NCAA Tournament every season. There is no way Baylor falls back down with the way Scott Drew is recruiting, Turgeon is doing a fantastic job at A&M, Frank Martin is going to keep winning at K-State, and Mike Anderson has Mizzou on track to win the conference in the next year or two.

Are we seeing a power shift in the Big 12 where teams that traditionally make up the top 5 (OU and OSU) fall down a little bit and former doormats like Baylor, K-State, and A&M take their place?

Or will OU pass those teams again and continue being one of the better programs in the Big 12?

 

[BigTime]

One year does not a trend make.

OSU is in fine shape with Ford imo. The jury is still out on our program, but it is too early to be making any definite statements.

 

[crawfish]

Just last year, I thought the power shift was that OU was on the rise to be one of the dominant teams. Who knew?

 

[thebigabd]

One year does not a trend make.

OSU is in fine shape with Ford imo. The jury is still out on our program, but it is too early to be making any definite statements.

True... but I would feel better about finishing top 5 every year if K-State, A&M, and Baylor weren't flying past everyone right now.

 

[gracefor24]

True... but I would feel better about finishing top 5 every year if K-State, A&M, and Baylor weren't flying past everyone right now.

I think you are on to something but it isn't like OU or OSU are left in the dust. It just means that where they used to be pretty much a Top 4 finisher every year now they have a lot of competition to get to that spot. Now you are battling KSU, ATM, Baylor, and Mizzou to get there. That is way different than the past where you might have 2 good teams from the North including KU and then 2-3 in the South. Now you have 5 really good programs in the South and 3 really good programs in the North with another (Colorado) on the rise.

 

[oSuJeff97]

True... but I would feel better about finishing top 5 every year if K-State, A&M, and Baylor weren't flying past everyone right now.

"Flying past everyone"... I'm not so sure about that. They both had one great year... the best for both programs in like 25 years. Let's see if they can sustain it. (And no need to cite incoming recruits... we all know how that can turn out.)

Both teams had deep and talented that included a lot of experience. Time will tell if Drew and Martin can re-load and continue to make runs in the tournament with rosters filled with different players.

To use the OU and OSU examples, that's what Eddie and Kelvin proved they could do... sustain winning basketball in between deep runs in the tournament.

And I'm not sure what exactly A&M has accomplished, other than stabalizing themselves as a mid-seed type tournament team. I don't believe they've made it past the second round, have they? They've also never won the conference or the conference tournament.

I do think it's better overall for all of the conference teams that Baylor, A&M and K-State are good, BTW.

I much prefer the state of the league now, as compared to, say 1997-2006 or so... when A&M and Baylor were horrible and basically 4 automatic wins every year. That's not good for OSU and OU in the grand scheme of things, IMO.

 

[NickZepp]

I think this was a bit of a down year for the Big 12. The conference had 4 really good teams. A few average teams. The rest of the conference really sucked. Kansas still dominated. Till someone takes them out we can't say there's a power shift.

 

[buttermaker1]

I think you are on to something but it isn't like OU or OSU are left in the dust. It just means that where they used to be pretty much a Top 4 finisher every year now they have a lot of competition to get to that spot. Now you are battling KSU, ATM, Baylor, and Mizzou to get there. That is way different than the past where you might have 2 good teams from the North including KU and then 2-3 in the South. Now you have 5 really good programs in the South and 3 really good programs in the North with another (Colorado) on the rise.

Like most years the south was again deeper. South sent more teams dancing whats new.

 

[Cheno]

I think you are on to something but it isn't like OU or OSU are left in the dust. It just means that where they used to be pretty much a Top 4 finisher every year now they have a lot of competition to get to that spot. Now you are battling KSU, ATM, Baylor, and Mizzou to get there.

This is what I think. KU will be in the top 4 every year and then it could be any combination of OU, OSU, UT, KSU, A&M, Baylor & Mizzou to round out the top 4. 7 teams fighting for 3 spots. There really isn't much separation between those programs right now and all have good young coaches.

 

[DFWHoopster]

although I agree with Cheno generally on his comments. I think you need to be careful assuming that KU is an automatic bid for a top 4 finish. There are some really good programs that learned that lesson this year: UCLA; North Carolina and UConn. You can throw OU in that mix as well.

A couple of bad breaks here and there and the wolves are at the door.

 

[OULad]

I think we will get back to that.

 

[luckyc1423]

I think this was a bit of a down year for the Big 12. The conference had 4 really good teams. A few average teams. The rest of the conference really sucked. Kansas still dominated. Till someone takes them out we can't say there's a power shift.

Down year? There was still 7 teams ranked throughout the year. And for several weeks running we had the #1 and #2 team in the nation

So if this was a down year, we are gonna flat out suck as a conference next year..

 

[NickZepp]

Last year was much better. Well look at the tournament we had last year. Every team won the first round in the Big 12 last year. Even though the tournament results ended up being only a little better. 1 Sweet 16 and 2 Elite 8 We also had 2 or 3 teams in the top 10 most of the season. This year there was Kansas and Kansas State and that was it for most of the season. Texas was up there till about midway through the season before falling apart.

 

[gracefor24]

although I agree with Cheno generally on his comments. I think you need to be careful assuming that KU is an automatic bid for a top 4 finish. There are some really good programs that learned that lesson this year: UCLA; North Carolina and UConn. You can throw OU in that mix as well.

A couple of bad breaks here and there and the wolves are at the door.

This is true but more the exception to the rule, imo. If Bill Self has proven anything it's that he excels at winning conference titles and dominating the regular season. Throw in the fact that KU plays in the North and they have an inherent advantage not to mention that they will consistently attract more talent as well.

Baylor has really dominated in recruiting and Turgeon is more of a Sampson/Sutton style coach whose teams will be consistently good. This is putting big time pressure on OSU and OU.

 

[buttermaker1]

You are correct KU has an advantage playing in the north most years.

 

[Cheno]

You are correct KU has an advantage playing in the north most years.

No need to rehash that argument. But even if it's true that advantage is miniscule compared to the advantage they have over the rest of the Big 12 in tradition, fan support, recruiting etc.

DFW...yes, KU could have an off year like UNC, UCONN, etc but it would be a fluke thing for them to not be in the top 4 just like it was for UNC this year. I mean UNC won it all last year. They will be back in the top 4 probably next year would be my guess. UCONN is a different story because you're talking about the Big East and they have a bunch of strong programs. As tradition rich as UCONN is it's not like they have a huge advantage, if any, over the likes of Syracuse, G'Town, Louisville, Nova, etc.

 

[Sooner Quick]

Down year? There was still 7 teams ranked throughout the year. And for several weeks running we had the #1 and #2 team in the nation

So if this was a down year, we are gonna flat out suck as a conference next year..

Ya I don't see this as a down year either in the Big 12. Just because OU wasn't as good doesn't mean the conference was down, in fact it probably made our season a lot worse. Where we could count on 2 automatic wins vs. Baylor were 2 losses.

 

[NickZepp]

It wasn't as down as maybe 06 or 07 was or a couple other years. But it wasn't as good last year or 02 or 03 was. Not as good as last year was.

 

[earlpearl]

The key for BU and ATM will be if they can keep their coaches. I am thinking at least one will bolt in the next couple of years.

 

[ByronHoustonsSweatyPalms]

A&M and BU could be scary due to the in state recruiting advantage they have. When they get on a roll, it could be hard to reverse the trend.