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[Big Old Booger]

I understand but coach's can't see the future either. The Groves brothers were an outstanding get for OU. Go back and read the commentary from experts too. We don't know all that went into portal recruitments but everyone was very impressed with what Moser did building the roster. That's all I'm saying. To call him terrible in the portal is pretty Ludacris IMO. The portal is very hit or miss. It seems like there is a lot of revisionist history going on. and I get it, we are fans and he is the coach. But still, it is pretty ridiculous some of the takes around here

this is laughable, but expected from you. :facepalm

 

[NickZepp]

Missouri?? And even OU and Texas only had one, maybe two great seasons. What is the obsession with acting like teams from the past are so much better? Why didn't any Big 12 team win a title? And outside KU, why did the league only have two teams make a lone FF if the top of the league was so great?

From like 2000-04 or 05 you had a top of the Big 12 that was usually elite. Oklahoma State also had a year or two where they were up there forgot about that. But you had the year in 02 where OU was final 4. That year Missouri went to the Elite 8. You had Oklahoma, Texas, Kansas all get beat by Syracuse that one year(03) You had Oklahoma State make a deep run one year. Now after that around 06 or so it started to go down hill for the conference even though I think Kansas won a national title in there but there wasn't as much top talent.

I don't think there's near as much talent on top in the Big 12 now it's all just about the same from about 1-6 or maybe 7 before you get some teams that just aren't that good like Oklahoma and West Virginia.

 

[allday92]

Los and Oweh are big 12 level athletes i think Benny is also but that remains to be seen

the 2 top 100 high schools kids he just signed are both reported to be high level athletes ..

if you want to see the underlying issue of this team it goes back to Lon Kruger recruiting

2019 class Hill very good others gone/bust
Harmon
Iwuakor
Hill

2020 class disaster
phipps
ogarro

2021 class not bad but should not be in the top 6 or 7 rotation
noland
cortes

this didn't set up porter

he is a builder and wants to build with high school kids ..

now is that a "fast fix" no but i believe it will work

Thank you. I was going to create a long post about how this has been a multi-year decline but other posters have covered it well in this thread. One thing I'd also add - the last time OU won 20 regular season games in the regular season was the final four year.

While yes, OU made the tournament in Lon's last couple of years, we did so as one of the last teams in, and as a 8-9 seed. That is not a sustainable place to have your program.

 

[NickZepp]

I've not been impressed with any of the rosters built by Moser based on results. Just not near as athletic not near as good as anyone else in the league. There's a reason the results have been pretty poor. I like Uzon and Oweh look like they have a little something and could be good in a couple years. When you look at the roster and say Godwin who is a walkon is our best inside player that's kinda sad and shows how bad our recruiting has been inside. Maybe a Shroeder turns it on and ends up being good next year and maybe the freshmen we get next year end up turning things around. But the roster we have built right now just is not any good.

 

[SoonerBounce13]

this is laughable, but expected from you. :facepalm

Thank you

 

[SoonerBounce13]

From like 2000-04 or 05 you had a top of the Big 12 that was usually elite. Oklahoma State also had a year or two where they were up there forgot about that. But you had the year in 02 where OU was final 4. That year Missouri went to the Elite 8. You had Oklahoma, Texas, Kansas all get beat by Syracuse that one year(03) You had Oklahoma State make a deep run one year. Now after that around 06 or so it started to go down hill for the conference even though I think Kansas won a national title in there but there wasn't as much top talent.

I don't think there's near as much talent on top in the Big 12 now it's all just about the same from about 1-6 or maybe 7 before you get some teams that just aren't that good like Oklahoma and West Virginia.

yep. People discount how good the top teams of the big 12 were back then. Very tough

 

[skyvue]

the 2 top 100 high schools kids he just signed are both reported to be high level athletes ..

Let's not forget that Noland, too, was a Top 100 recruit, so we can't really assume a top 100 ranking guarantees a top-notch college player (assuming that one has written Noland off, which some seem to have).

 

[Boom Soon]

Los and Oweh are big 12 level athletes i think Benny is also but that remains to be seen

the 2 top 100 high schools kids he just signed are both reported to be high level athletes ..

if you want to see the underlying issue of this team it goes back to Lon Kruger recruiting

2019 class Hill very good others gone/bust
Harmon
Iwuakor
Hill

2020 class disaster
phipps
ogarro

2021 class not bad but should not be in the top 6 or 7 rotation
noland
cortes

this didn't set up porter

he is a builder and wants to build with high school kids ..

now is that a "fast fix" no but i believe it will work

Man, I didn't realize it was that bad. Also, go back to 2018 and Lon only brought Bienemy in. Yikes.

 

[WichitaSooner]

From like 2000-04 or 05 you had a top of the Big 12 that was usually elite. Oklahoma State also had a year or two where they were up there forgot about that. But you had the year in 02 where OU was final 4. That year Missouri went to the Elite 8. You had Oklahoma, Texas, Kansas all get beat by Syracuse that one year(03) You had Oklahoma State make a deep run one year. Now after that around 06 or so it started to go down hill for the conference even though I think Kansas won a national title in there but there wasn't as much top talent.

I don't think there's near as much talent on top in the Big 12 now it's all just about the same from about 1-6 or maybe 7 before you get some teams that just aren't that good like Oklahoma and West Virginia.

Mizzou was a double digit seed that year. As for the top of the conference currently, any discussion of the top programs in the country the past three or four seasons would end in the conclusion that KU and Baylor are either the two best, or possibly Gonzaga is in the mix. Again, not only do we have the last two national titles, KU was the pre-Covid favorite in 2020, and Tech made the final in 2019. Are those teams just lucking their way into championships and top seeds if they are lacking talent?

 

[hoopsaustin]

Talking about efficient FG% and all that is great, but it doesn't necessarily mean that your offense is efficient. You have to look at turnovers, 2nd chance points, free throws, etc., so I like to look at points per possession. OU is ranked 155th in that regard because we shoot less shots than the opponents because of those things. OU averages 3 more turnovers than their opponents and gives up 2 more offensive rebounds per game, in conference they have 4 more turnovers and give up 3 more offensive rebounds per game.

I think Moser should be given until next year, but if he doesn't turn this season around and/or have a good season next year then I think he should be on his way out.

Solid post

 

[BoulderSooner]

Man, I didn't realize it was that bad. Also, go back to 2018 and Lon only brought Bienemy in. Yikes.

the 19 and 20 classes should be the basis of our program and we have Hill and that is it

 

[BoulderSooner]

Let's not forget that Noland, too, was a Top 100 recruit, so we can't really assume a top 100 ranking guarantees a top-notch college player (assuming that one has written Noland off, which some seem to have).

i like Noland but he is not a plus athlete and he is not "long"

 

[stormspencer]

this is laughable, but expected from you. :facepalm

Good to see you back buddy.

As to the thread, we can make the argument that we had become a little stagnant under LK, but at least we were making the tournament virtually every year. Outside of Grant, Moser has come up short in the portal. I don't judge by expectations, I judge by results. And the results tell us the that he miscalculated with his portal moves and underestimated what was needed to win in this conference. I want him to succeed because I hate losing and missing the tournament, but if he doesn't get this ship turned around in the offseason and have substantial upgrades (along with W/L results), we need to go another direction after next year.

 

[WichitaSooner]

the 19 and 20 classes should be the basis of our program and we have Hill and that is it

This just isn't realistic in the year of our Lord 2023. If this was 20 years ago, even 10, sure. But with or without a coaching change, how many programs currently have rosters full of guys who have stuck around for four years?

This isn't to excuse Lon for not bringing in better players. But in all likelihood, even if he had signed three or four more good players in those classes, they would likely only have one or two still here. Either way, how well or poorly he recruited wasn't going to determine whether Moser was in position to succeed this year. And if Moser really intends to "build" solely through high school kids the way you believe, then he is taking a huge risk and needs to realize that likely won't work. In the Mo Valley, maybe. Not in the Big 12/SEC.

 

[BoulderSooner]

This just isn't realistic in the year of our Lord 2023. If this was 20 years ago, even 10, sure. But with or without a coaching change, how many programs currently have rosters full of guys who have stuck around for four years?

This isn't to excuse Lon for not bringing in better players. But in all likelihood, even if he had signed three or four more good players in those classes, they would likely only have one or two still here. Either way, how well or poorly he recruited wasn't going to determine whether Moser was in position to succeed this year. And if Moser really intends to "build" solely through high school kids the way you believe, then he is taking a huge risk and needs to realize that likely won't work. In the Mo Valley, maybe. Not in the Big 12/SEC.

our current team would be a tourney team with an sec schedule

 

[jaymOU]

i like Noland but he is not a plus athlete and he is not "long"

He is not a starter on an upper division Big 12 team.....he's not even starting on a lower division Big 12 team now. I like his game and see improvement, but I am not excited about him being a starter. Rotational guy, sure, but if you are only going to get rotational guys from the HS ranks - Oweh, Cortes, Nolan - and really, Uzan, then you have to kill the portal. And despite some takes on here, I don't think Moser has killed the portal. He may have gotten who he pursued, but I don't think he pursued the right players.

 

[WichitaSooner]

our current team would be a tourney team with an sec schedule

Geez, you really think this? Arky smoked us, we struggled to beat a poor Florida team, we lost to a terrible Villanova team, couldn't beat the powerhouse Sam Houston, barely scraped by against Ole Miss and Seton Hall, both of whom are bad teams in their leagues. What have we shown to make you think we would be winning enough games in a league stacked with talent? The Big 12 is better than the SEC, absolutely. But the SEC is loaded with athletic, long teams full of physical freaks. Those are precisely the teams we struggle most against. The SEC currently projects for five bids, and we definitely wouldn't be one of the five best teams in that league currently. We would have to finish above .500 in that league to be in the mix. Right now, that seems impossible, unless they start keeping score based solely on effective FG%.

 

[SoonerBounce13]

Good to see you back buddy.

As to the thread, we can make the argument that we had become a little stagnant under LK, but at least we were making the tournament virtually every year. Outside of Grant, Moser has come up short in the portal. I don't judge by expectations, I judge by results. And the results tell us the that he miscalculated with his portal moves and underestimated what was needed to win in this conference. I want him to succeed because I hate losing and missing the tournament, but if he doesn't get this ship turned around in the offseason and have substantial upgrades (along with W/L results), we need to go another direction after next year.

it's not like he had his pick of portal players. I don't think he miscalculated anything. You take what you think is the best available and hope you find a player. like it or not, that is how it is with programs like OU

 

[SoonerBounce13]

Geez, you really think this? Arky smoked us, we struggled to beat a poor Florida team, we lost to a terrible Villanova team, couldn't beat the powerhouse Sam Houston, barely scraped by against Ole Miss and Seton Hall, both of whom are bad teams in their leagues. What have we shown to make you think we would be winning enough games in a league stacked with talent? The Big 12 is better than the SEC, absolutely. But the SEC is loaded with athletic, long teams full of physical freaks. Those are precisely the teams we struggle most against. The SEC currently projects for five bids, and we definitely wouldn't be one of the five best teams in that league currently. We would have to finish above .500 in that league to be in the mix. Right now, that seems impossible, unless they start keeping score based solely on effective FG%.

i believe so.

BTW, Florida is in the upper half of the SEC

 

[allday92]

Geez, you really think this? Arky smoked us, we struggled to beat a poor Florida team, we lost to a terrible Villanova team, couldn't beat the powerhouse Sam Houston, barely scraped by against Ole Miss and Seton Hall, both of whom are bad teams in their leagues. What have we shown to make you think we would be winning enough games in a league stacked with talent? The Big 12 is better than the SEC, absolutely. But the SEC is loaded with athletic, long teams full of physical freaks. Those are precisely the teams we struggle most against. The SEC currently projects for five bids, and we definitely wouldn't be one of the five best teams in that league currently. We would have to finish above .500 in that league to be in the mix. Right now, that seems impossible, unless they start keeping score based solely on effective FG%.

Yes, OU would feast on the bottom half of the league and could pick up a couple of homes wins vs teams like Kentucky, Florida, A&M, Mizzou.

Kenpom Rating:
2. Tennessee
3. Alabama
9. Texas
10. Kansas
12. Iowa St.
13. TCU
14. Baylor
19. Auburn
22. Arkansas
25. KSU
28. WVU
29. Kentucky
37. Ok St
41. Florida
48. Texas A&M
50. Oklahoma
55. Missouri
57. Mississippi State
64. Texas Tech
89. Georgia
93. Vanderbilt
95. Ole Miss
127. LSU
244. South Carolina