#23 OU @ UCF 3pm CST on ESPN+

[WichitaSooner]

You serious clark?
Top 25 has always been something to strive for.

It just has no bearing on making the tourney, where we stand in the conference, or anything that really matters. I’d bet most recruits have no idea who the bottom 10 teams in the poll are in any given week. I think we can all agree that we have been ranked solely on the basis of our nonconference record, and that it is now clear that we beat exactly one good team in that span. The NET rankings are way more important. The poll is an entirely subjective thing voted on by a bunch of people who may or may not actually watch games, especially during the first couple months of the season.

 

[SoonerBounce13]

It just has no bearing on making the tourney, where we stand in the conference, or anything that really matters. I’d bet most recruits have no idea who the bottom 10 teams in the poll are in any given week. I think we can all agree that we have been ranked solely on the basis of our nonconference record, and that it is now clear that we beat exactly one good team in that span. The NET rankings are way more important. The poll is an entirely subjective thing voted on by a bunch of people who may or may not actually watch games, especially during the first couple months of the season.

This just seems like another classic WS moment.
Taking something that is positive and making it irrelevant.
But if OU wasn't ranked all year, it would be something you would point out as a negative.
I've never seen a message board poster that has this ability like you do.

Top 25 has always been a measuring stick. But now it is meaningless because OU has been in the top 25 for most of the year
It is pretty evident that you hate Moser more than you love OU. At least own it

 

[WichitaSooner]

This just seems like another classic WS moment.
Taking something that is positive and making it irrelevant.
But if OU wasn't ranked all year, it would be something you would point out as a negative.
I've never seen a message board poster that has this ability like you do.

Top 25 has always been a measuring stick. But now it is meaningless because OU has been in the top 25 for most of the year
It is pretty evident that you hate Moser more than you love OU. At least own it

lol yea, it’s such a positive moment. My comment was in response to a speculative comment that “if we go 2-0 this week we will be back in the top 25.” Let’s hang a banner if that happens. Woo hoo, we’re number 25!!

As for Moser, have I ever denied that I think he has done an atrocious job at OU? I think that with the possible exception of Capel, he is the worst thing that’s happened to our program in four decades. I’d love for him to take the DePaul job or go back to a mid major after the season. The sooner that happens, the sooner we have a chance to reset.

 

[steverocks35]

Being in the Top 25 is relevant because it gets you on SportsCenter. It gets you on the crawl at the bottom of the screen on all the networks. It gets you included in lots of social media. It raises the visibility of the program immeasurably.

 

[SoonerBounce13]

lol yea, it’s such a positive moment. My comment was in response to a speculative comment that “if we go 2-0 this week we will be back in the top 25.” Let’s hang a banner if that happens. Woo hoo, we’re number 25!!

As for Moser, have I ever denied that I think he has done an atrocious job at OU? I think that with the possible exception of Capel, he is the worst thing that’s happened to our program in four decades. I’d love for him to take the DePaul job or go back to a mid major after the season. The sooner that happens, the sooner we have a chance to reset.

Winning the next 2 and being in the top 25 would be huge. The fact you joke that off like it wouldn't mean something is telling.
My comment on Moser wasn't to expose you for hating Moser. We all know that already. It was the speculate on if you hate moser more than you love OU....and that certainly seems to be the case with some of your opinions. It seems you would much rather OU faulter and you be proven right on Moser than for OU to succeed and you be proven wrong.

 

[WichitaSooner]

Being in the Top 25 is relevant because it gets you on SportsCenter. It gets you on the crawl at the bottom of the screen on all the networks. It gets you included in lots of social media. It raises the visibility of the program immeasurably.

I think that stuff meant more back in the days before every score of every game was easily accessible, and back when SportsCenter showed highlights of almost all top 25 games. I'd be surprised, for example, if a single highlight of our game at KSU was shown last Tuesday night. Look, I'm not saying it's a bad thing. I just think it is way down the list of things that matter. If we win two games this week, I will be more excited about where that will put us in the standings and the fact that a win over BYU would really help our resume. If a ranking comes along with that, great. But we were ranked 23 last week and that doesn't make me feel any better about losing three of our last four. Some people seem to think that as long as a number is next to your name, it means that things can't be that bad. I just disagree with that thinking, that's all I'm saying.

 

[steverocks35]

I think that stuff meant more back in the days before every score of every game was easily accessible, and back when SportsCenter showed highlights of almost all top 25 games. I'd be surprised, for example, if a single highlight of our game at KSU was shown last Tuesday night. Look, I'm not saying it's a bad thing. I just think it is way down the list of things that matter. If we win two games this week, I will be more excited about where that will put us in the standings and the fact that a win over BYU would really help our resume. If a ranking comes along with that, great. But we were ranked 23 last week and that doesn't make me feel any better about losing three of our last four. Some people seem to think that as long as a number is next to your name, it means that things can't be that bad. I just disagree with that thinking, that's all I'm saying.

I think we agree, I'm just saying that it's much better to be ranked than not to be ranked. And every little thing helps.

 

[BoulderSooner]

It just has no bearing on making the tourney,

to my knowledge there has NEVER been a top 25 team to miss the Dance (in the modern era)

 

[Sooner Season]

If you look at it from the UCF perspective, they just got a quality win against a Top 25 team that will be an NCAA Tournament team. We view it as a sign of impending doom or mediocrity, but they are likely viewing it as a great win for their resume.

Both of those thoughts can't be true.

Sure both things can be true. We viewed our wins against Iowa, USC and Providence as quality wins against a top 25 team but we were wrong, just like the UCF fans are.

 

[Sooner04]

to my knowledge there has NEVER been a top 25 team to miss the Dance (in the modern era)

I'm not sure what you quantify as the modern era, but here are two examples off the top of my head:
2004 Utah State
2014 SMU

 

[WichitaSooner]

I'm not sure what you quantify as the modern era, but here are two examples off the top of my head:
2004 Utah State
2014 SMU

And I bet it starts happening more often in the near future. We already see that seeding varies significantly from the polls because the metrics they use are so much more advanced than back in the day. Now, don't get me wrong -- if OU is in the polls heading into selection Sunday, we will certainly make it, because that will mean we have picked up some very impressive wins down the stretch. Our margin just got a lot thinner due to Saturday's no-show. Had we won that game, two wins over the Pokes and a win over Cincy would have gotten us in.

 

[TEvans4Three]

to my knowledge there has NEVER been a top 25 team to miss the Dance (in the modern era)

Utah St in 2004
SMU
Air Force

According to this reddit thread. I have no desire to go back through every AP Top25 and look

 

[BoulderSooner]

I'm not sure what you quantify as the modern era, but here are two examples off the top of my head:
2004 Utah State
2014 SMU

2014 SMU lost in the quarters of their tourney and were not ranked in the final poll before the dance ..

2004 Utah State is one .. I was not aware of that .. thank you ..

I guess I can change my statement to Power Conf Basketball Program ..

 

[TINY]

lol yea, it’s such a positive moment. My comment was in response to a speculative comment that “if we go 2-0 this week we will be back in the top 25.” Let’s hang a banner if that happens. Woo hoo, we’re number 25!!

As for Moser, have I ever denied that I think he has done an atrocious job at OU? I think that with the possible exception of Capel, he is the worst thing that’s happened to our program in four decades. I’d love for him to take the DePaul job or go back to a mid major after the season. The sooner that happens, the sooner we have a chance to reset.

I have laid out the comps between Lon and Moser to this point in their tenures. There are plenty of metrics that suggest Moser has done better to this point. To say moser has done an atrocious job to this point while jocking Lon is laughable. It takes time to build a program. We will see if Moser can keep building like Lon did. Though Lon could not sustain that success at all. The program faded fast after Buddy left.

Your disdain for Moser is obvious and confusing at best. I have to agree with @SoonerBounce13 in that it seems you would prefer ou lose over Moser having a successful career at ou. You didn’t even mention anything positive (that I saw) about how impressive it was to beat kstate and your boy Tang by 20 in manhatten. Something not even Kelvin or Lon came close to doing.

I tried to take up for you in the past and suggest you just wanted to see ou win but your posting habits suggest I was wrong.

 

[WichitaSooner]

I have laid out the comps between Lon and Moser to this point in their tenures. There are plenty of metrics that suggest Moser has done better to this point. To say moser has done an atrocious job to this point while jocking Lon is laughable. It takes time to build a program. We will see if Moser can keep building like Lon did. Though Lon could not that success at all. The program faded fast after Buddy left.

Your disdain for Moser is obvious and confusing at best. I have to agree with @SoonerBounce13 in that it seems you would prefer ou lose over Moser having a successful career at ou. You didn’t even mention anything positive (that I saw) about how impressive it was to beat kstate and your boy Tang by 20 in manhatten. Something not even Kelvin or Lon came close to doing.

I tried to take up for you in the past and suggest you just wanted to see ou win but your posting habits suggest I was wrong.

There is so much wrong with this post that it is hard to know where to start. Two NCAA tourneys for Lon in three years. Porter is fighting to get his first and the team is fading fast. The program is worse off now than when he was hired, when we had made four straight tourneys. Time to build a program? Well, he didn't have to build to get to the tourney, just sustain. And does it really take time? Someone should tell ISU, KSU, and Tech that -- they should slow down since their coaches have all done it in one season within our own league. As for Buddy -- he was a role player as a freshman. We made the tourney. He was better as a sophomore, and really good as a junior. Made the tourney both years and advanced to the Sweet 16 his junior year. He was only a star as a senior. To act as if Buddy was the only reason Lon had success is ridiculous. You are acting like he was Ralph Sampson and the best player in the country for four years. And does Lon not get credit for recruiting and developing Buddy? Los had a better freshman season than Buddy, but is regressing. Most of our returners over the past two seasons have regressed or stayed at the same level. Does coaching not factor in there? No credit for Lon for also developing Cousins? Woodard?

As for KSU -- it was a nice win, despite the fact they are awful right now. As for Tang, if they don't win another game this season, he still will have done more in his first two seasons than PM did. And let's also not forget that his best player was thrown off the team by the university president. I can only imagine how many excuses you would be making for Moser if JM or Los had been booted before this season. People would probably say that buys him another decade to get things back on track.

And why is my disdain confusing? Should I enjoy watching three years of fundamental mistakes and bad basketball? Of getting beaten by our rivals? If you think it is just me and a few others being unrealistic or "hating" Moser, here is some perspective: an hour ago, a local Wichita radio host was discussing how good the league is. He said there really aren't any teams other than KSU that could be considered a disappointment. Then, he paused, and said, well, arguably Oklahoma based on how they are playing now compared to nonconference. Quite a feather in our cap.

 

[Boom Soon]

I have laid out the comps between Lon and Moser to this point in their tenures. There are plenty of metrics that suggest Moser has done better to this point. To say moser has done an atrocious job to this point while jocking Lon is laughable. It takes time to build a program. We will see if Moser can keep building like Lon did. Though Lon could not sustain that success at all. The program faded fast after Buddy left.

Your disdain for Moser is obvious and confusing at best. I have to agree with @SoonerBounce13 in that it seems you would prefer ou lose over Moser having a successful career at ou. You didn’t even mention anything positive (that I saw) about how impressive it was to beat kstate and your boy Tang by 20 in manhatten. Something not even Kelvin or Lon came close to doing.

I tried to take up for you in the past and suggest you just wanted to see ou win but your posting habits suggest I was wrong.

I don’t think is necessarily fair to say WS would rather see OU lose than see Moser succeed. Unless he’s got like a personal vendetta against the guy. He clearly is not a Moser fan, but there were people calling for Lon’s head the last couple of years too. It happens.

I do think it’s important to point out Lon’s and Moser’s job within the program. I understand metrics matter but I don’t think they paint the whole picture.

Lon’s job was to resuscitate the program after Capel. In reality maybe he did have more talent to work with than we remember, and heck maybe even more talent than Moser. But he still had the challenge of reviving a program on life support. He did that and more. He completed his job. There was no way he was going to be let go after the final four season because only like three years before that no one even thought a final four run was possible. You could definitely make the argument that the program was sliding downwards under the last few years of Lon. Just look at his recruiting lol. But, he had completed his job of bringing it back to relevancy. He retired at the perfect time.

Now you bring in Moser. I’m going to out on a limb and guess that his job was to win championships at OU. I’m going to guess the word “mediocre” was not mentioned in his interview with Joe C. Now obviously that takes time and Moser did not have a lot of talent to work with in year one. Maybe less than Lon did. But it has been proven by multiple programs that a very quick turnaround can happen if you get the right guy in there. The days of taking four or more years to build something are over. And it’s the same thing being said about Venables and the football program. Do we feel like Moser has the program on the right track to championships? That is the question we should be asking ourselves as fans. Because that’s what Moser was brought in to do. Not keep the status quo but make it better. I’m going to guess that is where WS’ frustration stems from because that’s where a lot of fans’ frustration is stemming from. There’s not a feeling of improvement in the program aside from recruiting. But recruiting is half the battle. It feels like the same program for the last five years. But that is not what anyone thought we would be feeling year three of Moser.

I think we ALL want the program to succeed. I don’t think there’s a poster on here who doesn’t want OU to win. WS is just more vocal about his doubts about Moser than others. But I don’t see anything wrong with that because we can all see it to an extent.

 

[SoonerBounce13]

Bottom line, WS enjoys when we lose. It isnt hard to see. That’s not a fan in my book and he shouldnt be allowed to post. At this point he is just a troll

 

[Boom Soon]

Bottom line, WS enjoys when we lose. It isnt hard to see. That’s not a fan in my book and he shouldnt be allowed to post. At this point he is just a troll

He is absolutely not a troll. Call him a negative nancy or not a “great” fan but don’t insult the guy. He knows way too much about OU basketball to just be a troll.

 

[steverocks35]

Bottom line, WS enjoys when we lose. It isnt hard to see. That’s not a fan in my book and he shouldnt be allowed to post. At this point he is just a troll

I'd much rather hear from someone giving his honest opinions of the team and coach than someone who lives to police the board and scold everyone he disagrees with

 

[TINY]

I don’t think is necessarily fair to say WS would rather see OU lose than see Moser succeed. Unless he’s got like a personal vendetta against the guy. He clearly is not a Moser fan, but there were people calling for Lon’s head the last couple of years too. It happens.

I do think it’s important to point out Lon’s and Moser’s job within the program. I understand metrics matter but I don’t think they paint the whole picture.

Lon’s job was to resuscitate the program after Capel. In reality maybe he did have more talent to work with than we remember, and heck maybe even more talent than Moser. But he still had the challenge of reviving a program on life support. He did that and more. He completed his job. There was no way he was going to be let go after the final four season because only like three years before that no one even thought a final four run was possible. You could definitely make the argument that the program was sliding downwards under the last few years of Lon. Just look at his recruiting lol. But, he had completed his job of bringing it back to relevancy. He retired at the perfect time.

Now you bring in Moser. I’m going to out on a limb and guess that his job was to win championships at OU. I’m going to guess the word “mediocre” was not mentioned in his interview with Joe C. Now obviously that takes time and Moser did not have a lot of talent to work with in year one. Maybe less than Lon did. But it has been proven by multiple programs that a very quick turnaround can happen if you get the right guy in there. The days of taking four or more years to build something are over. And it’s the same thing being said about Venables and the football program. Do we feel like Moser has the program on the right track to championships? That is the question we should be asking ourselves as fans. Because that’s what Moser was brought in to do. Not keep the status quo but make it better. I’m going to guess that is where WS’ frustration stems from because that’s where a lot of fans’ frustration is stemming from. There’s not a feeling of improvement in the program aside from recruiting. But recruiting is half the battle. It feels like the same program for the last five years. But that is not what anyone thought we would be feeling year three of Moser.

I think we ALL want the program to succeed. I don’t think there’s a poster on here who doesn’t want OU to win. WS is just more vocal about his doubts about Moser than others. But I don’t see anything wrong with that because we can all see it to an extent.

wanting a championship type program requires the investment of a championship program. We aren’t even in the same stratosphere of the championship programs when it comes to NIL, fan engagement, arena, and the list goes on.

I am hoping Moser gets us to to point that fans begin to support this program like the Kansas, UNC, Duke, Kentucky fans do but we are literally magnitudes lower than those programs in every way, shape, and form.

People need to take a step back and look at where this program is from an investment perspective. We are behind the Texas techs and Baylors let alone the real blue bloods. We have to entice our fans to come to games with $2 beer and popcorn. Texas tech fans drove from west texas and packed our arena a few weeks ago. Something tells me ou fans wouldn’t do the same if we played them in Lubbock this year.